My last post explored the struggles Erin and I have had defining our swinger playstyle. In short, swingers often define their limits by what they want to do, and as such swinger profiles often contain descriptors like soft swap versus full swap and separate or same room to define the actions and arrangements couples seek out with others. But these aren’t detailed or nuanced enough for Erin and me to define what each of us needs to get from a play session for it to be worthwhile. It wasn’t until I started viewing intimacy as a finite resource that gets used during and (hopefully) replenished after swinging experiences that I got a grasp on how to make swinging scenarios more successful for Erin.
Perhaps this could also be called jealousy management? I’m not sure if Erin would classify her feelings in these instances as jealousy, but even so, these same concepts might apply to jealousy for other couples.
Disparity in Our Limits
You see, in our relationship, Erin has the unfavorable position of being the play limiter. I’m willing to go further and have fewer limits in general. I think it fair to say she needs my support through swinging events and requires a feeling of connection and intimacy with me in order to relax and feel comfortable having the sex with other people.
I don’t have this same need. Or rather I don’t think we will ever get to a point where we hit my limit before hitting hers.
But I have to be sensitive and responsive to her needs for her to have a good time. This won’t work—in fact it will damage our relationship—if I just go by my own instincts and not work to support her.
Walking Away From Swinging
Erin: In our last post, we talked about the possibility of just walking away from swinging. I said that if that does end up being our decision, for me it would be because I found that the difficulty of being assertive about my needs outweighs the enjoyment of the swinging experiences.
What Shane refers to here is an extension of that same difficulty in that I am always going to know that I am the limiting factor. That knowledge and disconnect between what each of us wants out of this might be too great a distance to breach. If I am always feeling bad about pulling us back from things, I can’t have a good time.
I don’t mind the limit so long as I understand what the limit is and have a clear understanding of how not to cross it. This is where it would be easier if the limit were action based. That we’re soft swap but never full swap. That’s easy because it’s concrete.
What makes things problematic for me is that Erin’s comfort level with things can often seem situational therefore hard for me to quantify. I don’t know what I can and can’t do if I don’t understand when or what about my actions might make her feel uneasy. The concept of intimacy as a finite resource has helped me get a better handle on that.
Still I never want to upset her or hurt her feelings. If I don’t know how to navigate swing sessions so as to not hurt her, I’d rather not swing. I will never get enough out of swinging to risk making Erin feel bad.
From Whence Does This Division in Needs Arise?
I think a good deal of us needing different levels of connectivity is directly related to how turned on each of us gets from swinging experiences, specifically in watching the other with someone else.
Whether it’s a single guy or a man from another couple during a swap, I get highly turned on watching Erin with other men. I even enjoy watching her flirting with other guys. Just seeing them approach her at parties and clubs gives me a thrill. I would gladly watch her getting gangbanged.
Hell, I’m even fine with her having sex with an appropriately vetted bull without me being there.
She likes having the attention of multiple guys. We’ve only ever had one single guy join us at a time, but in theory, she would enjoy having more. She fantasizes about more. She also likes it when I step back and just watch as another guy fucks her.
Erin: I feel the need to point out that it is knowing how much it turns Shane on that feeds this desire in me. Without that element, being with another man or men, separate from Shane, would have little to no appeal. The thrill that I get out of it is the energy exchange between Shane and I. Watching him get turned on by watching me is the focus of the experience.
What’s Good for the Goose Is not so Hot for the Gander
Erin can see me having sex with another woman and enjoy the aesthetics of a relatively OK looking guy having sex with an attractive woman. The same as if she were watching any live-action fucking that could happen in a club.
But if she’s viewing it as me, her husband, having sex with another woman, that can be difficult for her.
It certainly does not turn her on.
Sort of…
Erin: I’m not sure if it is accurate to say that it doesn’t turn me on. I guess it isn’t inaccurate so much as incomplete? It’s hard for me to figure out how to describe it, which certainly explains why it has been so confusing for Shane.
In some of our earlier swinging experiences, I found that I could enjoy the sight of him with another woman more if I kind of removed myself from the situation a bit. I could enjoy looking at a sexy man and woman getting it on and just not think about my husband being intimate with someone else.
Group sex turns me on, and it turns me on to watch him as part of a group play experience. What I don’t like is a feeling of separation during play. It would not turn me on to step back and just observe the way it turns Shane on to watch me.
I have been struggling with this because I don’t want to feel that way. But what I am realizing now is that I can’t force this. If it doesn’t turn me on, it doesn’t turn me on, and that’s okay. Not positive or negative, it just is. I need to focus on what does turn me on about swinging and try to get more of that!
I recognize that it is possible for things to evolve, but for that to be possible I need to spend more time in my comfort zone doing things I legitimately enjoy.
Comfort-Based Limits Versus Action-Based Limits
As we discussed how action-based limits didn’t apply to our playstyle, that we had more comfort-based limits (which are more nebulous and therefore difficult to define), it became clear that those times when Erin became unsettled during a play session, it was due to how some acts appear more intimate (for lack of a better word) than others. Activities that caused a greater perception of intimacy between me and someone else drained her feeling of connection with me.
For example, a woman going down on me appears less intimate in her eyes than me having sex with that same woman.
Which is the very reason why there is a divide between soft swap and full swap for swingers. Obviously many people view oral sex as less intimate than vaginal sex.
But not Mrs H of the Bedhoppers. Which I understand. To be fair, there are tons of things I would rub my dick on that I wouldn’t lick.
However, that perception isn’t limited to specific acts. If it were, we could just be a soft swap couple. Rather, Erin also perceives a difference between watching me fuck someone doggy style versus missionary style. Missionary seems more intimate and therefore it is more likely to provoke a negative reaction.
Just as she perceives me getting a blowjob across the room or out of sight as more intimate (and therefore more unsettling) than me having sex right next to her.
Which is the very reason why I say that us being soft swap versus full swap isn’t exactly accurate either.
Explaining Intimacy as a Finite Resource
Hence this theory of intimacy as a finite resource. I was going to call it Intimacy Bucks and explain it as a currency, but I decided that sounds too much like a reward/punishment system and it’s not. This is more in line with Spoon Theory of chronic pain management. Or even the Fill the Bucket explanation of self-care and kindness.
Establishing the Baseline
In our relationship, Erin and I both have an Intimacy Rating between 0 and 10, with 0 being no intimacy at all—we’d be getting a divorce if we stayed at that level for long—and 10 being a feeling of absolute love and connection.
Most of the time, we’re riding at about a 7.
Fluctuations in Intimacy Levels
If we have a wonderful, connecting experience, that can bump up our rating for a time. A romantic date night might be a small bump whereas something like our recent anniversary trip to the mountains of Maryland for bike riding and hiking would be a larger and longer bump.
Other times, we might be dragging a bit and feel a little disconnected. Maybe one of us is stressed from work or sick or what have you. We’re not talking as much, not fucking as often, and just generally less connected.
A few months ago, I was working out too hard and not eating enough. I was overtrained and suffering from adrenal fatigue. My libido was down (but not gone). There was a noticeable shift in the energy of the household. We were probably riding at about a 6, maybe even a 5 given the pandemic going on. But we talked, made adjustments, and fixed the issues.
Getting down to a 5 or below isn’t bad. It’s part of the ebb and flow of a normal relationship. But that’s when we need to be active in repairing whatever angst we’re feeling so that it doesn’t get worse. Like begets like. A downward trend is likely to continue if not addressed.
Sometimes all that we need is to schedule the time for some good old fashioned hardcore (maybe even kinky) sex to lift us from the rut. Other times we might need a romantic weekend together or an MDMA evening.
All of these are just tools we can use to reestablish our feelings of connectivity.
Applying This Model to Lifestyle Events
We can apply this model of intimacy as a finite resource to lifestyle and swinger experiences specifically. Yes, I’m going to discuss how those experiences can be different.
Draining Intimacy
For Erin, certain swinger activities are potentially a drain on her intimacy level. I’m going to use concrete numbers for this example, but please realize that is only for ease of understanding. We have not verified the timing nor checked the relative drain of any event. And surely there are so many variables at work that no actual mathematical calculation will ever apply. (Much to my chagrin!)
There are specific variables that we do know exist, however; so let’s take a look at each in turn.
Erin: I won’t have much to add here because this is more about Shane making sense of this in his own mind. It helps him to have some way to quantify it. I wouldn’t describe it nearly so scientifically, but if you’re a reader of this blog you know a little bit about how Shane’s brain works!
Distance Variable
The degree of physical space between us is a factor. As Erin noted in the last post she was able to clarify her use of the word swap by saying she’d rather I have sex with someone next to her then get a blowjob from someone across the room.
To extrapolate that out, me getting a blowjob might drain 1 point from her intimacy rating every five minutes. If we are going into a swinger event with her at 10, then after 15 minutes of me getting a blow job, Erin would be at a 7, and I need to start checking in and making sure I’m slowing or stopping the draining before she’s uncomfortable.
If I were 10 feet away from Erin getting a blowjob, that might drain her intimacy level at a rate of 1 per every minute. It’s not going to take very long before she’s unsettled by the experience.
If I were to go off into another room to get a blowjob, that would drain all the intimacy instantly. I would also be cheating most likely. Separate room play isn’t within our current acceptable boundaries.
Factor in actual physical contact between Erin and myself, that’s a drain reducer. Me touching her, kissing her, even just making eye contact, all of that builds connection. Whatever else we might be doing, that connection is a reminder we’re doing it together.
Position Variable
Certain sex positions just seem more intimate. Missionary style, for instance, with the ability to make eye contact, kiss, have full-body contact. Not to say every time we have really emotional, love-y sex it’s in missionary nor that every time we’re in missionary it’s emotional, love-y sex (after all, it’s really easy to whisper some really fucked up dirty shit into someone’s ear in missionary), but most of the time when we’re having the really emotional, love-y sex, it’s in missionary.
So it makes complete sense that if Erin sees me in missionary position with someone else, that feels more intimate between me and that other woman. The more intimate I am with someone else, the more of a drain on her intimacy that act is.
Therefore, me having sex with someone in missionary might drain Erin as a rate of 1 point every two minutes whereas me having sex doggy style might drain Erin’s intimacy at a rate of 1 point per four minutes. Again, I can slow the rate of loss by making eye contact with Erin and touching her during. But there is still a loss. Eventually, over enough time, we need to come back together as a couple and restore some intimacy between us.
Connections With Other Couples
The level of trust and comfort we have with another couple will also affect the drain. We both like building up friendships alongside the sexual relationship with others. Having this connection helps relieve some of Erin’s shyness, which then helps her relax into the play session. By being with someone she has a level of trust with, she needs less emotional support to come from me.
This is why we say we usually don’t play on the first date (but that’s a guideline, not a rule; we certainly have). That’s said more to ease expectations than anything else. It takes the pressure off the first date. We don’t need to make this time lead to anything.
And why we only soft swap on the first swap. This first swap experience is meant to gauge compatibility, establish comfort, and see how communication works between everyone. Full swap would be extremely draining for her.
I can see how there is a certain in-the-moment energy that can propel people from meeting to sex across a couple hours. More power to you! But that’s not our general speed. I’m interested to see how we’d react at a swinger event like in-person Podcast-A-Palooza or a lifestyle vacation at Desire.
Could we meet new people and establish a rapport quickly enough to play with another couple before the event was over? Or would we just feed off the sexual energy of everything going on around us and spend our time “building intimacy” between us?
Nonfactors
The above factors are based on us actually swapping. There are other non-swinging, lifestyle play activities that don’t produce a drain.
Parallel play or cross play, for instance, don’t cause a drain because I’m with Erin the whole time. We get energy from having other people near us, so if anything, it’s a boost.
I’m not exactly sure about me kissing other women. It seems to not be a factor. But then I also don’t spend much time doing so and certainly not with women we don’t already have a connection with. (Yet another reason I’m leery about playing lifestyle games with strangers.)
I haven’t had any long make-out sessions with anyone other than Erin. I’ve played games that might state “kiss for 1 minute” or something, but we’ve never played those with people we weren’t at least on soft-swap terms with.
Nor am I sure where flirting would be, but given my reputation for being a flirt, she might be so used to it that it doesn’t register.
That’s a lot to juggle! Kind of makes you wonder why we bother at all.
Erin: Reading it all laid out like this makes me wonder for sure. I realize that things are actually clearer to Shane now and that he is therefore more comfortable/confident that we can make it work, but it does sound like a lot of work! Still, I console myself by thinking about how I am not this high maintenance in any other aspect of our life. I swear, I am not this much work under normal circumstances.
True. In general, she’s real easy.
Building Intimacy
We bother because even though the event itself might drain intimacy, the time leading up to the event and the aftercare following builds intimacy.
Sex and feelings of intimacy build on each other so as one goes up the other goes up. We both enjoy and get horned up by our expectations for and experience of lifestyle and swinger events.
If we are feeling like we’re in a rut, at a 5 or a 6, we could go to one of the local sex clubs, get horny from the vibe, fuck out in the open, and be riding a kinky sex high for days. Our intimacy rating is increased from the sex act itself and continues to rise from all the sex it inspires after. We can do this because non-swap lifestyle activities (exhibitionism and voyeurism) are not draining acts.
But we wouldn’t try to swap if we were in a rut. Our levels would be too low to sustain any outsider involvement.
When we have a swinger event coming up that we know (or at least hope) will involve some level of swap, we can fortify our levels by having more sex with each other beforehand. Which is already something that is likely to occur without conscious effort because we’re both turned on by the anticipation of the event.
Basically, we build to a 9 or 10, the swap experience might deplete us down to a 7, but then the aftercare takes us back to 10, and we stay there for several days after.
In the long run, net positive. We just need to make sure Erin doesn’t dip too low during the event.
And she has.
Getting Better at Avoiding Depletion
We’ve learned a lot over the years about how to avoid depleting intimacy. And some things more recently.
First off, we’ve learned that we can stock up on intimacy before a swinging event.
Second, we know the more comfortable we are with people, the less draining an activity is. Progressing slowly through multiple dates and less intense experiences helps ease us in.
Third, we have learned the closer the contact between us during a swap, the less the drain. Listening to the Bedhoppers helped us realize that concept.
Fourth, the better the during- and aftercare, the better the end experience. The more I can show I am able to respond to Erin’s needs in the moment, the more she will be able to relax during these events.
I would say after that it’s just practice.
Amusingly, I used a similar analogy just the other day in regard to fitness: Someone who is new to living a healthy lifestyle might find diet and exercise very stressful. Thinking about and managing a diet might be 4 points of stress. Working out might be 3 points. Trying to do both in a day already has them at a 7 on the stress-o-meter.
For me, someone who has been doing this diet-and-exercise thing for years, worrying about intake is like a 1 and doing workout is a -1, so overall maintaining a healthy lifestyle is little to no stress (though training for a specific goal like weight loss or running marathon does increase these values).
I think with more experiences in general and more positive experiences specifically the rate of drain from any swap event will decrease.
Alas that we don’t have many opportunities to practice.
Chemical Assistance
I would be remiss (and totally off brand) if I didn’t point out how substances influence intimacy as a finite resource. Which is why the use of any number of substances is so often tied to the lifestyle. Erin and I aren’t the only ones who experience some form of drain and have found ways to cope.
Though for some, that’s merely the drain of having to be social and engaging. Once they get to the bedroom, there might be little to no need for the assistance. You’d think swingers would be naturally outgoing and social. But given the number who report being shy or having social anxiety, it’s amazing anyone manages to hook up ever!
Alcohol
Alcohol is the obvious one. So much so, most people don’t even consider it a drug. It’s a staple at swinger and lifestyle events. Heck, I was just scrolling Twitter as I edit this, and Swinging Downunder asked what people did to help prepare themselves to go on dates. Having a few drinks was the most common answer.
I don’t think Erin has ever attempted a swap experience—or even an exhibitionism lifestyle experience—completely sober. She doesn’t need to be drunk, but a little alcohol helps take off the edge.
Erin: Finding the sweet spot with alcohol is key. It’s great when I can get just tipsy enough to be relaxed and remove inhibitions and ride at that level for most of the evening.
Me? It’s impressive the things I do sober.
Cannabis
Some people find weed helps them relax. Cannabis is known for stimulating sexual response and enhancing physical enjoyment. Vaping and e-cigarettes have become more mainstream to the point that even otherwise smoke-free venues allow their use. These days, it’s nearly impossible to tell if someone is vaping cannabis, which makes it easy to toke up in public areas.
Before our interview on the Swinging Downunder podcast (episode 104 if you want to hear our voices), Cate put out some polls about drug-use at lifestyle/sex-positive events. As expected, several people replied with weed “if you even count that.” 420-friendly is a designation some swingers put in profiles to show they are recreational cannabis users. As cannabis becomes legal for recreational use in more places, I imagine the stigma around being high will go down.
Erin: Although cannabis absolutely helps me relax when I am at home with Shane, and it definitely enhances sexual response, it doesn’t work for me in social situations. It makes it very difficult for me to process what people are saying and hold conversations. Trying to communicate adequately starts to make me feel panicky. So it’s pretty much exactly the opposite of how I want to feel at a lifestyle event.
Psychedelics
Given the prevalence of consensual nonmonogamous activity at events like Burning Man that have a high degree of psychedelic use, I would say some people find substances like LSD, 2C-b, and psilocybin enhance connectivity. Free love, man!
In my explorations, I’ve come across several stories of people partying on shrooms at raves and lifestyle events. I can’t even imagine given the introspective headspace psilocybin puts me in. We’ve had difficulty having sex on psychedelics even when that was one of the goals of our trip! But set and setting are so powerful in psychedelic experiences, maybe the right vibe will stoke the party mood.
Something to try at some point For Science!
And Many More
GHB/GBL, cocaine, any of the many amphetamines (of which MDMA is one); there are dozens of substances out there that enhance social connection, remove anxiety and fear, and lower inhibitions. That’s not inherently a bad thing.
From our own experience, we know that MDMA is pretty much guaranteed to put Erin at a 10+ on the intimacy meter with little chance for being drained to a level at which she would be uncomfortable.
There are people out there who prefer to play while on substances (sometimes exclusively: see Party and Play) like this because it’s a quick and easy way to feel a multi-person connection and not experience any emotional drain.
But that’s the very reason why we don’t use MDMA that way. We know it can create a false security. Creating a connection with our swinger playmates is not something we want to skip over/fast forward through. That’s why we roll with friends rather than at sex clubs.
Erin: Right, and when we are lucky enough to have those lifestyle friends that are also real friends (Han & Leia, I am looking at you!), we can enjoy MDMA with them because we know the connection is real. The foundation was already built naturally.
Chemical Hindrance
I might be drug-positive in general, but I want to be honest as well. I don’t want to create a false narrative about these substances being great for everyone all the time. It’s neither useful nor productive to lie about substance use.
So I would be remiss if I didn’t say that any of the above drugs can just as easily befoul a swap experience if taken to an extreme. Overindulgence of substances can lead to miscommunication with your significant other and your play partners, which can ruin your night or worse: damage your relationships.
I recommend that you don’t try a new substance for the first time at a lifestyle event. Develop an understanding of how you react to a substance first. Know your dosage. If you don’t know how you will react to something, it can ruin your night.
Even though a substance might work for some people in a play situation, it might not work for you. Our cautionary tale not only explores how MDMA made us over-confident in our ability to swap but also reveals how the addition of the psychedelic 2c-b turned what should have been a not-so-great-but-manageable moment into a swinging nightmare for Erin.
We’re lucky that experience didn’t damage our relationship. But it certainly cooled our jets on full swapping for a while. Erin is still working through some of the trauma from that feeling of abandonment.
Intimacy as a Finite Resource Isn’t a Novel Idea
At its core, this concept isn’t some amazing revelation. How often do we hear the advice that swinging isn’t going to fix a broken relationship but rather will show all the flaws? I think most people with even a little history in the lifestyle realize that there is a potential for drain. But appropriate before-, during-, and aftercare help mitigate (or even reverse) that drain.
Personality, kink, self-confidence, substance use, and experience—all of these things factor into how much of a drain exists. I’m sure some swingers have never experienced it and would wonder what the fuck I’ve even gone` on about. Others worked through it and no longer experience this when they swap.
But what this concept really brought to light for us are the factors that cause Erin’s drain. What influences her comfort level most is her reaction to her perception of the intimacy I have with someone else compared to her. That time away from her, physical separation, and even just body position all directly and immediately influence her comfort.
I certainly didn’t understand all of that back when we were using the word swap differently.
Erin: So we have actually come a long way in a couple of months, since Podcast-A-Palooza provoked some difficult conversations. After all of these years dabbling with and coming in and out of the lifestyle, we may finally have hit on what works for us. It remains to be seen if that abstract idea will work in reality.
That and we need to befriend people willing to deal with this level of crazy….
Seriously, the more posts I write, the more even I’m like “Why would someone want to play with us? We cray-cray!”
Good thing we are using pseudonyms….